Egypt – An Egyptian paper claims that archaeologists have discovered ancient Egyptian coins bearing the name and image of the Biblical Joseph.
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The report in Al-Ahram boasts that the find backs up the Koran’s claim that coins were used in Egypt during Joseph’s period. Joseph, son of the Patriarch Jacob, died around 1450 B.C.E., according to Jewish sources.
Excerpts from the Al-Ahram report, as translated by Middle East Media Research Institute (MEMRI):
“In an unprecedented find, a group of Egyptian researchers and archeologists has discovered a cache of coins from the time of the Pharaohs. Its importance lies in the fact that it provides decisive scientific evidence disproving the claim by some historians that the ancient Egyptians were unfamiliar with coins and conducted their trade through barter.
“The researchers discovered the coins when they sifted through thousands of small archeological artifacts stored in [the vaults of] the Museum of Egypt. [Initially] they took them for charms, but a thorough examination revealed that the coins bore the year in which they were minted and their value, or effigies of the pharaohs [who ruled] at the time of their minting. Some of the coins are from the time when Joseph lived in Egypt, and bear his name and portrait.
“There used to be a misconception that trade [in Ancient Egypt] was conducted through barter, and that Egyptian wheat, for example, was traded for other goods. But surprisingly, Koranic verses indicate clearly that coins were used in Egypt in the time of Joseph…
“Research team head Dr. Sa’id Muhammad Thabet said that during his archeological research on the Prophet Joseph, he had discovered in the vaults of the [Egyptian] Antiquities Authority and of the National Museum many charms from various eras before and after the period of Joseph, including one that bore his effigy as the minister of the treasury in the Egyptian pharaoh’s court…
“Studies by Dr. Thabet’s team have revealed that what most archeologists took for a kind of charm, and others took for an ornament or adornment, is actually a coin. Several [facts led them to this conclusion]: first, [the fact that] many such coins have been found at various [archeological sites], and also [the fact that] they are round or oval in shape, and have two faces: one with an inscription, called the inscribed face, and one with an image, called the engraved face – just like the coins we use today.
“The archeological finding is also based on the fact that the inscribed face bore the name of Egypt, a date, and a value, while the engraved face bore the name and image of one of the ancient Egyptian pharaohs or gods, or else a symbol connected with these. Another telling fact is that the coins come in different sizes and are made of different materials, including ivory, precious stones, copper, silver, gold, etc.”
“The researcher identified coins from many different periods, including coins that bore special markings identifying them as being from the era of Joseph. Among these, there was one coin that had an inscription on it, and an image of a cow symbolizing Pharaoh’s dream about the seven fat cows and seven lean cows, and the seven green stalks of grain and seven dry stalks of grain. It was found that the inscriptions of this early period were usually simple, since writing was still in its early stages, and consequently there was difficulty in deciphering the writing on these coins. But the research team [managed to] translate [the writing on the coin] by comparing it to the earliest known hieroglyphic texts… Joseph’s name appears twice on this coin, written in hieroglyphs: once the original name, Joseph, and once his Egyptian name, Saba Sabani, which was given to him by Pharaoh when he became treasurer. There is also an image of Joseph, who was part of the Egyptian administration at the time.”
If this can be proven (which of course will be very hard to do) it would be pretty cool to see a coin from Yossef Hatzadik’s times.
wow how did vin news find a picture of yosef hatzadik
I have a bridge to sell. Baloney, let them give us pictures if they have them. They don’t and that’s why you won’t see them. The first coin from Egypt that we know of, is from the last Pharaoh who was replaced by Alexander the Great. I forgot his name at the moment.
At best they have carved stones, with wishful thinking interpretations. We don’t even know which Pharaoh was at the time of the Exodus, and they have already identified Yosef Hatzadik?
Yosef hatzadik had a beard, as we all know vheim loi hiciruhu, sheyozo beloi chasimas zokein, & then he had one.
So the picture without a beard is doubtful IMHO.
the shevatim didnt recognize Yosef because he had a beard…
The pic looks more like michael jackson then yosef hatzadikk
Yeah, right. Coins were not invented until long after Yosef’s time, well into the time of the first Beis Hamikdosh. Not only did Yosef never mint any coins, nor did Dovid or Shlomo.
Yakov also uesd coins when he bought the Meorath Hamacpelah from Ephron
Reply to #10
Avremele Says:
“Yakov also uesd coins when he bought the Meorath Hamacpelah from Ephron”
You’re probably a bit confused, since it’s nearly a year since last Parashas Chayei Sarah, but it was Avraham (not Ya’akov) who bought the Me’arat Hamachpeilah from Efron…
A Gmar Chasima Tovah to everyone…
When he left Yaakov he did not have a beard and he became ruler a few years later. So maybe the coin was minted BEFORE he grew the beard.
Well, if he aint wearing a “Chulent Tup” hat, then he’s no Heimisher..
Here is the Chasam Sofer.
החת”ס (דרשות חת”ס ח”א עמ’ ק”ג (: הענין כפמ”ש תוס’ ב”ק צ”ז ע”ב (ד”ה מטבע), כי מטבע של אברהם אבינו ע”ה ודוד המע”ה לא היה חקוק עליהם שום צורה, כי אם נכתב עליהם זקן וזקינה וכדומה, וכן מצאתי בספרים שחקיקת צורה על המטבע נתחזק על ידי מלך אחד בערך כמו ב’ מאות שנה אחר בנין בית הראשון, אבל מקודם לזה לא היו יודעים מזה מאומה.
how could that be yosef hatzadik? there is no way yosef would have looked like a mitzri.
Here is the secon Chasam Sofer I mentioned.
חת”ס עה”ת (פ’ שמות) שבזמן בית ראשון לא היה נכתב שום צורה על המטבע, רק כתב מפותח שזה שקל, שהצורות על המטבע נתחדש ממלך אחד מאתים שנה לאחר בנין בית ראשון.
It was a great sign of respect – Yosef was on the 5 dollar coin and it said 1200 BCE
The Chasam Sofar doesn’t say it was never done, he speaks in general.
Reply to #!5
Yakov also used cueerncy, see Breishis 33, 19,
Isn’t there proof directly from the Torah thatr there were coins in the times of Moshe? Wasn’t the Machtzis Hashekel a coin? Rashi brings down a Medrash Tanchuma that states Hashem showed Moshe a coin of fire to show him how it was supposed to look.
Yosef wasn’t a prophet. I don’t care what the Koran says because it’s full of BS. The Torah does not say that he was a prophet.
if this is true, it is amazing, but it is probably not true. Note the article specifies that the Koran claims were used in the times of Yosef, yet this appears to be untrue based on archeology. So, the point of this article is to prove a sheker that is found in the Koran, which is a book of sheker. .
Yoisef Hazadek did not have a beard at all, because if he did his brothers would have recognised him immediately. The logic is: According to Rashi,Yoisef looked exactly like Yaakov. Yaakov had a beard, so if Yoisef also had a beard, why wouldn’t his brothers have recognised him, “ela mai” Yoisef’s beard did not grow and the brothers were looking for somebody with a beard that would resemble Yaakov.
can i have one cto hang up in the sucah?
you don’t need the koran to prove that yosef used money when he sold his stored wheat. the Torah states that clearly. Yakov sent the brothers with money (coins) to buy wheat. And Yosef put the money back in their sacks. Also, the Torah says that the wheat was sold for money except to their priests, who did not have to pay. And the Torah says that he turned over all the ‘cash’ to paroh.
Someone named Morris silver wrote a nice article bring proofs for Pre-Hydian coinage. Egyptian hieroglyphics speak of “shati”. From his article:
Visual evidence of the shat in circulation may perhaps be provided in a market scene of the thirteenth century from a tomb in Thebes. A man takes a container of beer or wine from a booth in exchange for two circular white objects. Glanville considers it “likely that they are enlarged representations of the shaty.” Alternatively, the circular objects may represent copper coins (see below). Note the expression “busy as copper” in Papyrus Lansing (Topic I.F.2).
There is more that needs to be said about the previously mentioned quotation of the price of a house in an Old Kingdom transaction. The word shat in the Giza inscription was understood by several Egyptologists to be an early form of shawet or shayet “cakes” or “loaves.” This, I believe, should be noted despite Peet’s (unexplained) assertion that “the objections to this interpretation are very serious.” The mention of “loaves” or “cakes” is made even more interesting because in Papyrus Boulaq (column 1, line 4) we find partial payment being made in shayet me kenken “beaten/crumbled cakes, making 1½ pieces [= shat]” (Peet). As noted above (section 3c) there are clear references to monetary “loaves” and “cakes” in Mesopotamian and Syrian texts.
Now we return to the ideographic writing of shat “piece.” By the Middle Kingdom the ideograph included a distinctive sign that “we know very well from carefully made hieroglyphic examples … represents a cylinder seal with a loop of string passed through the hole to suspend it by” (Peet; emphasis added). Again, in a mid-second millennium text (and elsewhere), the term shat arguably denotes the flat seal of a signet ring (djebat) (Castle). This connection is most significant because the seal is firmly linked to the known history of coinage in the Greek world. The Greek word sêma meaning “sign, token,” has been found on coins of the seventh and sixth centuries BCE from the temple of Artemis in Ephesus: “This is the sêma of Phanes.” Balmuth concludes that this is “the equivalent of a sealed piece of pre-weighed metal.”
As for Charile Hall’s question, assuming there were no such thing as pre-Lydian coinage, this drasha could have been made during the bayis sheini, according to the Rambam who says all the drashos were NOT given at Har Sinai, just the 13 middos and the halacha leMoshe Misinai. Finally, They could have forgotten the drasha and rediscovered it during the Second Temple. I also like the Tal Torah’s pshat. Askupeh, the gemaar says that the coins of
Avrohom Avinu had a young boy and girl on one side and an old man and woman on the other. This could be allegorical of course. Since much of archaeology depends on the accident of the archaeologists’s spade, I can’t come up with any definite answer.
It doesn’t have to look EXACTLY like him….have you ever made a stick figure? Have you ever actually seen a person that looks like one? I hope not. It could be a representation of Yosef, and not be intended to actually look just like him.
Why do so many of you say this isn’t true?!? Why can’t we learn new things about history via this type of work?!? The Egyptians were a very advanced culture and MANY thing attributed to the later Greeks were actually fully developed under Old Kingdom Egypt! I am obsessed with ancient Egypt and this article seems completely likely to me. There is so much we have gotten wrong about history and we need to be open to new information and not cling to what we already know.
I have read the original article on Memri and recommend that others do the same. Clearly, these objects are not actually “coins.” The head archeologist, Dr. Thanet, defines them as coins because they are sort of precious materials (but most are stones, not metal); because they are sort of round (but most are oval and some are shaped like Kheper, the dung beetle); and because they are sort of flat (but mostly not exactly); plus they often have some writing on them. Well, the Egyptians wrote on just about everything — walls, clothing, furniture, coffins, perfume bottles, you name it. They also wrote on their jewelry. These things often have a hole in them so as to be worn on a string. Sounds like a bead to me. Some are depicted in reliefs as being worn on a string around somebody’s neck and some have somebody’s name on them. Some have magic spells on them and other archeologists thought they were — wait for it — magical objects like charms or amulets. Some have a date, namely the year of some pharaoh’s reign. Having a name and a date makes them really, truly coins, says Dr. Thanet. Well, even today I have round, flat things with a name and date on them that won’t purchase anything. They’re called campaign buttons.
The Egyptians had something akin to currency before coins called the deben and shat. Neither was a coin. Egyptologists like Faulkner and Gardiner discussed these when I was studying hieroglyphs a long time ago. I’m an old lady now and nobody else in Egyptology thinks Dr. Thanet is correct. We won’t accept the reading of the prophet’s name or Saba Sabani (his Egyptian name according to Dr. Thanet), until we see it ourselves, in Egyptian, in a clear photo. I didn’t see it on the Memri site. If it’s Dr. Thanet’s proof, why not show it?
He also says he found a “coin” with a cow on it, which is his other “proof” it’s Joseph, because of pharaoh’s dream. Could this not be an ordinary Egyptian cow named Hathor? Is every cow on every relief and bit of jewelry a sign of Joseph? Americans are as anxious to see every bit of the Bible proved true as anybody, but it would be nice to see some evidence that’s more believable than this.