London – Rabbi Aryeh Sofrin was anxious just like the scores of other people scheduled to meet the Queen of England, but for a different reason: what would he do if she reached out for a handshake?
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The Chabad shaliach to Ilford, Essex, located northeast of London, was about to be dubbed Member of the British Empire for 18 years of work as head of a drug and alcohol rehabilitation center that serves Jews, Christians and Muslims – and even has an imam on the staff.
He had been briefed on proper protocol, but did not know what to do about the handshake that ends every audience with the Queen. And on this particular day, she had chosen not to wear her gloves…
But she must have been briefed about him, concludes Rabbi Sofrin, because at the end of their short meeting the 83-year-old Queen Elizabeth II remembered to avoid the customary handshake.
The following video below is presented courtesy of Israel’s Channel 2, which interviewed Rabbi Sofrin following his meeting with the Queen.
nice for the queen to remember
What a kiddush hashem and kol hakovod to Rav Sofrin, shlita, for his wonderful work and this unique recognition. Thanks also to VIN for bringing this to us. I can imagine that Hamodia and certain other unnamed newsites would have blacked out the Queen’s likeness from the video.
A great Kidush Hashem!!!
What’s the big deal about shaking a woman’s hand in a business context? My Rabbi says it’s no problem.
Great honor for a great job. I wander do you say a brocha in the presence of a queen?
I’m just wondering the halachah here. The Order of the British Empire (of which “Member” is part of) is essentially christian, with it’s own chapel at st paul’s catherdral and a badge that has the symbol of the order on a cross. I’m not making any accusations here, but forgive me if I fail to understand how a torah yid can stand there and join a christian “organization” and have a cross pinned on his jacket.
She looks like a Yiddisha Mama adjusting her son’s tie before his Shidduch date.
The Rabbi need not have worried. The Queen has met many Orthodox Jews on many occasions. She made Rabbi Emanual Jacobovitz into Lord Jacobovitz (I guess now we know the almighty’s last name 🙂 )
If a 5 year old, goyishe shikse, doesn’t know “not to shake hands”, it to be expected, but if she is of normal intelligence, for a grown-up in politics, never mind if she wants to be called “queen”, what is the ‘Big Chidush’ that she knows whom she is to be talking to, and what his religious laws dictate, is appropriate, and what is not appropriate to do.
Any neophyte in politics should know his own citizens, peoples religious doctrines, as it relates to their immediate interaction at their SCHEDULED face to face meeting.
Even if the queen didn’t have much Sechel, on her own, to ask and to know, and to find out, how to behave herself, at the very least all her advisor’s around her knew Very Well, who is who, and what is appropriate contact and what is not and her advisor’s and associates certainly told her well in advance what to do and what not to do.
Such meetings are not at random and are well planed months in advance and everyone knows exactly what to do and what not to do and what to say and what not to say well in advance.
Instead of worrying about shaking hands, how about going out and doping chesed and kiruv as the chabadnik did.
sufrin is the correct spelling i know cuz im a sufrin from london. Aryeh devora and family keep up your good work ! from one of your ch cousins!
With the swine flu I am sure the Queens prefers not to shake everyone’s hands.
To #6 , Please back up your statement with a name of a posek / rov.
Sufrin.His father became a Lubavitcher
This episode reminds me of the story when Wilhelmina the queen of Holland came to meet the previous Minkatcher Rebbe to receive his blessing for she was childless. When she stretched out her hand to shake the Rebbe’s, the Rebbe with his great wisdom remarked that it does not fit for a commoner to touch the hand of her majesty. The queen was very impressed and this story ended in kiddush Hashem. BTW she had a child who was named Juliana and her daughter Beatrice is the current queen of Holland.
G-d forbid that he recuse himself from the honor so as not to place himself in a situation where the Queen would be publically humiliated. And G-d forbid he depend on a leniency which I’ve even seen Satmars in good standing depending on.
The Queen deserves a lot of gratitude and respect for taking the care to try not to offend the Rabbi or put him in an comfortable position. We can all learn from that example as to how to treat others. Of course, if she didn’t know or didn’t remember after greeting so many other people, that would have been entirely understandable and it would have been rude for the rabbi not to shake her hand if she offered hers. Not publicly embarrasing someone is more important than not shaking a hand. There is nothing remotely sexual about shaking a hand in this context.
In the early 80’s PM Margaret Thatcher visited a display by the Lubavitch girls school in London about Jewish women. It was a summer day and she was wearing very short sleeves. One part was about tznius. She studied the pictures, read the text carefully and then turned to her driver and told him to bring up her shawl. She put it on and wore it the rest of the time she was there. Another part was about negiah. She read it carefully then put her hands behind her back (like a gerrer chusid after the chulent) and kept them there until she left.
2 years later a group of shluchim went to 10 downing for a meeting with her. When they entered her office, she immediately put her hands behind her back (I guess to remind herself not to start a handshaking).
If you stand strong in what you believe, and say it b’darkei noam ub’darkei sholom, people will respect you.
Rabbi Sofrin is fortunate that the Queen did not shake his hand. However, there is a different issue: negiah al yadei davar acher. Based on the picture, that seems to be an issue. If negiah al yadei davar acher is negiah, see the Taz in YD hilchos nidah and there is a shailoh how to learn the Taz, then it is just as good as shaking hands with the Queen and the Rabbi has not gained anything from this.
Lakewood NEEDS a Drug Rehab
Who cares. There are hundreds of unsung heroes who have strutted their stuff to promote cohesion & rehabilitation in their cities for over 40/50 years & never received an obe or mbe.18 years?is that some kind of joke?
Don’t know if its true but I heard that moshe reichman didn’t shake the queens hand when they met years ago
The Queen does not shake hands with ANYONE. Not even the President of the USA. NEVER. Look at the protocols available on line. The rabbi had nothing to worry about.
All these posters claiming it’s 100% assur to shake hands have obviously NEVER asked the question to a posek.
Rav Aharon Soloveitchik zatzal held it is mutar to shake a woman’s hand only if she extends her hand first, This is because he held the only issur in such a sitaution is derabanan, and kovod habrios is de’oraysa, so kovod habrios is docheh.
Rabonim who are musmachim of Rav Aharan Soloveitchik are somech on this psak.
Not all forbidden relationships are “Yehoreg veal Yaavor”.
There are some that are and some that are forbidden but still not “Yehoreg vela Yaavor”.
wait so its ok that she touched him to put the badge on him, but not ok to shake his hand.
oh grow up everyone. its the bloody queen of the country!!!!!!! if she shakes ur hand, damn right u better shake hers back!
My daughter won a regional spelling bee and in front of the whole crowd the judge came to congratulate her and he put out his hand. She shook it and then asked me if it was wrong. I told her she did the right thing because she just made such a kiddush hashem and that would of ruined it not to mention embarrass the judge. We need to use our brains!
For what its worth HM The Queen has been doing this since 1953, she has a clue about protocol. More important she has a staff who are paid to make sure she is well informed. I don’t know if she shakes hands normally but I’m sure if it was an issue her staff would have made sure that she would be briefed.
And she is always well dressed when in public.
It should also be noted that the OBE and other honours are given out by the Queen but on advice of the PM, who has a staff who compiles the list. So the Rabbis name was probably put up by a someone local who made a good case for him. Maybe his local MP or the like.
Regarding shaking a women’s hand look in the uncensored edition of Rav Chayim Berlin’s responsa #135 where he paskens that when shaking the women’s hand is a matter of protocol or derech eretz and the person is not doing it for sensual reasons it is muttar. Rabbi Aharon Rakeffet publicly stated in a shiur (available on line) that Rav Y.B. Soloveitchik in certain circumstances shakes the hands of women. If Rabbi Rakeffet is too mizrachi for some would you say that about Rav Chayim Berlin, son of the Netziv and ultra-orthodox rov of Yerushalayim ? Again just another case of charadi revisionalism.
Just to set the record straight. The queen did NOT pin the medal on. All receipients have a magnet hook on their clothing which they put on before they go in to receive their medal. The queen just puts the medal on the magnet.
Rabbi Sufrin did not ask for this award, it was promoted by many people who feel he has done a great service to many and they wanted to see him honoured for this.
He has stated many times this is all about a Kiddush Hashem and an honour for Chabad, The Rebbe ZYA and Klal Yisroel.
I hope this answers some of the issues that seem to be disturbing some of you.
Let us rejoice in the positivity of this award and recognise it for what it is.
every one is debating backwards and fordwards mutar or osur i mean even the queen knew one is not supposed to shake hands!! Those who say it is ok are you saying that now rabbi suffrin is actually insulted that the queen did not shake his hand.
oh puhlease, shaking the hand of an 80+ woman is a problem? Besides, whats the big deal, there are many of our holy yidden visiting all those massage parlors.
Has my Rosh Yeshiva Shlita likes to joke “shema yisrael hashem elokinu hashem achad – everything else is machlokes”.
Why does the olam need to make such an arguement and criticise each other about something that already happened and is over.
Just for example there are many times in the gemara when rashi and tosfas argue, or rishonim dispute how to learn a passuk in chumash, is one wrong and the other correct? I don`t know, and i doubt most people that have learnt the differing opnions properly know either.
The point is has we see many times in the mishnah breura and other sefarim, some people go one way and others the other. Does that make those who follow one opinion frum/orthodox and those that don`t follow that opinion not frum or reform. The obvious answer is NO. That is the beauty of Torah both opinions are correct has long as they are legitimate and endorsed as such by an emesdik rav/ posek.
People need to learn to respect each others differences and rebbeim wether or not you personally follow the same rav and opinion. For those of you going on about moshiach and caring wether or not it comes, i belive this is the only way he will come, wether or not you agree with me
wow,
Where does it say one cannot shake an old woman hands past her prime
reply to 83
I am very suprised that you do not consider Rav Chaim Berlin legitimate, or will you say since it’s not party line then it must be a forgery?
1) Shut Nishmas Chaim (R Chaim Berlin) says that people will regard a talmid chacham as bizarre for refusing to shake the hand of a woman, he should not be machmir. Me-ikar hadin, it is not derech chibah. (#135 in old edition; 3:5 of new edition.)
2) R Shimon Shkop was known to have given a woman his hand. He said, “Assur lehalbin.”
3) R Hutner permitted taking her hand if it would save her from embarrassment, but cautioned to “Take it like a hot potato.”
start learning see tosafos sotah daf 19 a d”h vkohen from yerushalmi. and then see sefer divrei torah from the munkatcher madurah 9 # 40.
Dayan Ehrentrau and Abba Dunner once had lunch with the Queen. They ate hermolis catering and certainly did-nt shake hands with her. She is briefed before every meeting and knew jolly well not to shake his hand. In fact like one comment above she rarely shakes hands with anybody. This article hot nisht kein HENT in feece!
First off, the United Kingdom is an officially Christian country. There is a state church, the Church of England, and the flag is three different types of crosses superimposed one on the other. So every time a British yidden touches the national flag, and I surmise they DO have them on display in the shuls, he or she touches three crosses. So the medal with one little cross is no big whoop.
As for shaking hands with people, the Queen shakes hands with people in private audiences like this…it’s just public ones where she would be worn out shaking hundreds of hands. But the one thing the Queen is supposedly a master of, is making people feel comfortable around her. She has just shown, yet again, that she is the definition of the word, “lady.”
These comments are great. I love reading everyones various opinions. “Umi k’amcha Yisroel Goi Echad Bo’aretz”. es voheiv bsufa!
why is she fixing his tiw